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  • The Draft Loophole

    There has been some talk about the draft selection loophole. For those who don't know, here is an example of it:

    In 2003, the Vikings had the 7th overall pick, but did not make their selection in the allotted time. Two teams, the Jacksonville Jaguars and Carolina Panthers, went ahead of them. Then the Vikings picked Kevin Williams with the 9th overall pick. They were going to select Williams with the 7th overall pick anyways. It's just that they got him at 9th. Instead of signing him for 7th overall money, they got a discount and signed him for 9th overall money.

    All this does is make a mockery of the current system. Draft orders are formed in a specific manner for a reason and they are not to be abused by other teams looking to get a discount. So, here is my proposal:

    If a team cannot make their selection in the allotted time (10 minutes), the team that is next is not put on the clock and the first team receives a 10 minute extension to decide. If they do not decide within those 10 minutes, their pick is forfeited and the next team will be put on the clock.

    There we go. This removes the incentive of team "trading down" in an attempt to get the same player at a discount.

    ---------

    Obviously, this can't be done for this draft since it's only 2 weeks away. But I would like to see this implemented for future to prevent teams from cheating.


    Rorshach's Journal

  • #2
    Every team would take the 10 min. extension

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    • #3
      Originally posted by SuperUberBob View Post
      There has been some talk about the draft selection loophole. For those who don't know, here is an example of it:

      In 2003, the Vikings had the 7th overall pick, but did not make their selection in the allotted time. Two teams, the Jacksonville Jaguars and Carolina Panthers, went ahead of them. Then the Vikings picked Kevin Williams with the 9th overall pick. They were going to select Williams with the 7th overall pick anyways. It's just that they got him at 9th. Instead of signing him for 7th overall money, they got a discount and signed him for 9th overall money.

      All this does is make a mockery of the current system. Draft orders are formed in a specific manner for a reason and they are not to be abused by other teams looking to get a discount. So, here is my proposal:

      If a team cannot make their selection in the allotted time (10 minutes), the team that is next is not put on the clock and the first team receives a 10 minute extension to decide. If they do not decide within those 10 minutes, their pick is forfeited and the next team will be put on the clock.

      There we go. This removes the incentive of team "trading down" in an attempt to get the same player at a discount.

      ---------

      Obviously, this can't be done for this draft since it's only 2 weeks away. But I would like to see this implemented for future to prevent teams from cheating.

      Its not really cheating, and your looking at it from a skewed point of view. Draft order is not set up to guarentee that worse teams are forced into signing their rookies into more ridiculous contracts, it is designed to give teams in descending order from worst to best a first come-first serve-first look at the talent available.

      If a team elects to "cheat" as you like to put it, then they are taking the risk of another team selecting the player they have targeted. And in all reality, if Kevin Williams was willing to sign his #9 overall contract, being drafted at #9, the valuse of the contract would not have changed much from #7, since his contract is only about 1 million a year off from what DT John Sullivan signed as the #6 overall pick that year.

      So all in all, they did not really save much, if any as to what he would have signed for at #7.

      Also the incentive for trading down tends to be more picks later in the draft than saving money, unless your dropping way back in the trade down...
      Last edited by Craig Smith; 04-15-2008, 12:07 PM.

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      • #4
        See, the only thing with that is that Minnesota can say Williams was the player they wanted, who knows if it's the truth? There's a very good chance they wanted Leftwich, but to save face over a mind boggling mistake, they just say "Oh, well we wanted Williams anyway, so it didn't matter." Plus, if I remember correctly, they had problems negotiating a contract with Williams, as his point of view was, if you were going to take me #7, then I want #7 money. I really doubt there are too many teams that are that willing to possibly lose a player they covet in order to save a few bucks on a contract that it necessatites instituting a rule change.

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        • #5
          The rookie cap needs to be adjusted anyway so that money is not a factor in the pick. The economics of the game have changed since the last CBA. There is no way any rookie is worth 20mil+ in guaranteed money without playing a single down.
          Bears offseason wish list:

          Jay Cutler, I am good, for now.

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          • #6
            I think if you let your time run out then you should go to the end of the round.

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            • #7
              Originally posted by Drumsteroo View Post
              The rookie cap needs to be adjusted anyway so that money is not a factor in the pick. The economics of the game have changed since the last CBA. There is no way any rookie is worth 20mil+ in guaranteed money without playing a single down.
              Exactly. Plus, it doesn't make sense to say that, making such a move, or negotiating a lower price with the first overall pick, (like Parcells is doing) is "making a mockery of the draft". That's just the union and idiots like Gene Upshaw talking. It works to the benifit of the teams to be able to have such flexibility... and ulitimately, that works to the advantage of the players too.

              Sure, you can say that is sucked for Kevin Williams to be drafted 2 picks later, but clearly teams didn't think he was worthy of the 7th overall selection anyway, so instead of a team reaching on a guy based on need, they got the guy they wanted at the right position. Plus, that move worked to the advantage of the two players who ended up sliding ahead of Williams. So, in the end it was a win-win situation for the players, the teams and the league. The players union just doesn't like it because, like all unions, they love seeing guys get big money who haven't earned it. So, they are having their spokesmen at NFL network complain about it to try to sway the public into backing a proposal to "fix the rules".
              Last edited by ZN0rseman; 04-15-2008, 12:27 PM.
              sigpic
              WFB Comments on Vikings @ Steelers Game Rigging
              PuppyPuncher:"It sure was nice enough of Roger Goodell to let the refs from Ark-Florida officiate the Vikings-Steelers game"
              NoNonsenseCoach:"As a Steelers fan living in Pittsburgh I can still admit that tripping penalty was a complete ghost call."
              Simonds:"The tripping call was awful, yes, but there were a number of other absurd calls that went against the Vikings, including a DEFENSIVE delay of game penalty against the Vikings only called after a failed attempt to convert a third and 2 by the Steelers. Even the commentators were utterly floored that the refs made that call."
              Wraith36444:"A shady tripping call on Minnesota essentially gave the game to the Steelers. The Vikings were the better team, but it is too hard to beat a decent team and the refs. Oh and Harvin is the man."
              MaineMan:"I have to agree that it was an awful call and that it changed the outcome. Overall a great game by the Vikes and tragic that the well-deserved victory was stolen away like that."
              PaddyPatriot:"I've seen this play and I have to agree, I can't believe they called it tripping"
              Johndoe:"You know the officiating is bad when a Steeler's fan, like myself, thinks it was pretty bad."
              Steelers_Pens_Fan:"I will admit that the whole "tripping" thing probably shouldn't have been a flag."
              ZN0rseman:"It's great to know that good old fashioned pro football game rigging is still alive and well in America."
              Klunker18:"I'm with Z on this one. Definitely one of those games that makes you wonder if the NFL wants certain teams to win."
              TRICKaz"I agree that was a BS call"
              InjuredReserve:"Have yet to hear anyone say it was the right call. Seems as if the Vikings were cheated a bit."
              Eagles4Life:"Coaches just need to be able to challenge penalties"
              EL_Guapo:"The tripping call was bad, the delay of game was stupid Either way, the Vikings showed they are a top team."
              EllijayFalconsFan:"The tripping penalty was rediculous."
              Archon095:"Even as a Steeler fan I agree that the call was bull."
              BroncosCon:"I'm sorry that was a total bull**** call and it changed the outcome of the game. Pittsburgh still won, but it was almost like Denver winning at Cincy."

              Tony Dungy:"The Vikings are just one bad tripping penalty away from being undefeated.
              Jon Gruden:"That was just a bad, bad call. It cost the Vikings an important win at Pittsburgh, and it could really hurt them in the post season."

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              • #8
                How is it a mockery? It is a smart move. If I were Parcells, you bet I would let time expire on the first pick. You save $$ that way.... luduicrous amounts of money guaranteed to guys who have never played a snap in the NFL... who could turn out to be busts.

                The draft - particularly no rookie salary cap - is already a mockery, if you want to use that term. I think teams that let the clock run out are smart. There is a lot of $$ involved here, jobs on the line... you can't take that lightly.
                NY Giants fan since birth.

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                • #9
                  Until this is fixed, it makes financial sense for the Phins to wait on thier pick. they have a guy hanging out by the podium with 4 cards, each w/ a different name. the rams falcons and raiders pick, then that guy runs up there with the dolphins pick. soon youll have every team hanging out sitting on thier hands, and some rich team like dallas will run up and take mcfadden with the #22 overall pick, pay him #1 money ( jones doesnt care) and everyone else will scramble.

                  What parcells should do to prove the point, negotiate with a 2nd round prospect ( carl nix, flacco, brohm, etc) and take some insane low ball contract at #1 and screw all the other prospects out of that money since no team will give a contract worth more than the #1 overall
                  Bears offseason wish list:

                  Jay Cutler, I am good, for now.

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                  • #10
                    i agree... unless some move like this is pulled to piss off king upshaw... then nothing will get done about a rookie cap.
                    NY Giants fan since birth.

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                    • #11
                      there is a rookie cap, but its based on the amt of picks you have, and I believe it only affects the current year, after that all players on the roster are counted in the real cap ( except the next years rookies, obviously). I LOVE the NBA's system of paying rookies. It needs adjustment b/c it takes NFL players longer to make a contribution ( on average) than NBA, but it prevents teams from going to hell because they f*cked up a top 5 pick, and allows them to make the pick they want when they want it. This will increase trades and also make the draft more interesting to watch, IMO.
                      Bears offseason wish list:

                      Jay Cutler, I am good, for now.

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                      • #12
                        It's not going to happen.

                        I would love to see Miami do it though, then the Rams don't make the pick, etc. etc.

                        So the draft would go on for an hour and no team wants the first pick.
                        2014-2015 Kentucky Wildcats (38-1)

                        Congrats to Wisconsin. Even more congrats to UK haters.

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                        • #13
                          It will never happen, but a change would be nice.
                          Bears offseason wish list:

                          Jay Cutler, I am good, for now.

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                          • #14
                            Then it creates a giant slippery slope. First the Dolphins pass. Then the Rams then every other team. Everybody will be sitting around for 5 hours trying to find a team interested in selecting 1st overall. Then when it gets to the Giants and they pass, the Dolphins have to decide (again) if they want the first overall pick. Nobody would ever be picked and Mel/Todd would run out of things to say, leaving a ridiculous amount of dead air that will be filled in by the inane babbling of Chris Berman. Would you guys really want this?

                            There's no way the NFL would allow a rookie salary limit. They'd rather just remove the salary cap all together instead. Teams would probably work around it and create contracts with little guaranteed money, but have a ridiculous amount of easy incentives to reach (throw a pass, take a snap, attend practice etc).

                            I like saintsfan's idea of having people go to the back of the round if you pass on your pick. It sounds better (and less strict) than mine.


                            Rorshach's Journal

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                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Drumsteroo View Post
                              there is a rookie cap, but its based on the amt of picks you have, and I believe it only affects the current year, after that all players on the roster are counted in the real cap ( except the next years rookies, obviously). I LOVE the NBA's system of paying rookies. It needs adjustment b/c it takes NFL players longer to make a contribution ( on average) than NBA, but it prevents teams from going to hell because they f*cked up a top 5 pick, and allows them to make the pick they want when they want it. This will increase trades and also make the draft more interesting to watch, IMO.
                              I agree on the NBA part. I think that it should all be structured down the line, slotted out to the pick. I think that they should all be four year contracts for first rounders, and the last two years should be team option years, and negotiable.
                              www.5qsports.com, get some.
                              "Relax, all right? Don't try to strike everybody out. Strikeouts are boring! Besides that, they're fascist. Throw some ground balls - it's more democratic."
                              -Crash Davis, Bull Durham

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